The Hidden Cost of DBE Recertification: Trauma, Trust & Resilience | Yajaira Morphonios

What happens when a certification process meant to create opportunity begins to reopen old wounds?

In this powerful episode of Diversity Conversations, Eric Ellis and Tommie Lewis welcome Yajaira Morphonios, Founder & CEO of Strategic Alliance Consultants, for a timely discussion on the evolving reality of DBE recertification, leadership under pressure, and the emotional toll many disadvantaged business owners are now facing.

From Puerto Rico to Kentucky to Louisiana, Yajaira shares how family values, resilience, cultural identity, and strategic partnerships shaped her leadership journey in construction, infrastructure, and disaster recovery.

Together, the conversation explores:
• The new DBE personal narrative requirement
• Why recertification can feel retraumatizing
• The hidden human cost behind compliance
• How small businesses can remain visible and competitive
• Why partnerships are the future of growth
• The mindset required to keep showing up

This is more than a conversation about certification. It’s about what leadership looks like when systems change, pressure rises, and your values are tested.

Connect with Yajaira Morphonios:
LinkedIn: Yajaira Morphonios
Website: strategicallianceconsultants.com

Chapters
00:00 Welcome + leadership reflections from the week
06:30 Meet Yajaira Morphonios
12:00 Family values, Puerto Rico, and leadership roots
20:00 Culture, music, youth courage, and identity
25:30 The DBE recertification crisis begins
29:30 Why the personal narrative requirement is painful
36:30 Tommie’s powerful trauma story
45:00 How Strategic Alliance Consultants supports DBEs
51:00 The power of partnerships for business growth
57:30 Final message: resilience, adaptation, and leadership

Tags:
Diversity Conversations, DBE recertification, disadvantaged business enterprise, business resilience, leadership, trauma and trust, strategic partnerships, construction leadership, minority-owned business, women-owned business, supplier diversity, entrepreneurship, Tommie Lewis, Eric Ellis, Yajaira Morphonios

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:02

Welcome to Diversity Conversations, where we engage in thought-provoking dialogue to identify leadership solutions to today's most challenging conflicts. Stream live each week, Saturday, 9 30 a.m. to 11 a.m., hosted by Diversity, Equity and Inclusion Strategists and CEOs Eric Ellis and Tommy Lewis. Join us and add your voice to this engaging diversity conversation.

SPEAKER_05 0:30

Good morning, Greater Cincinnati, Northern Kentucky, the United States, and the world. My name is Eric Ellis, and I'm the president and CEO of Integrity Development Corporation. And I'm joined this morning by my good friend and brother, Tommy Lewis, president and CEO of Make It Plain Consulting.

SPEAKER_02 0:45

Good morning, Eric. Good morning, T. What's up, baby? What's up? Hey, nothing much. It's a beautiful day this day on Saturday. I know I say that often, and when I say it, sometimes it's 10 degrees. Right. And sometimes it may be north of 100 degrees. Right. But today, weather-wise, it's a beautiful day.

SPEAKER_05 1:03

It is a beautiful day, man. And uh it's a beautiful day in the neighborhood. Uh, Tommy Lewis and I are happy. This is uh Easter weekend, resurrection weekend, and uh we are grateful to be in studio uh talking to you, community. We thank you for joining us every week from around the world. Tommy, how was your week, man?

SPEAKER_02 1:24

My week was good, Eric. Uh had a lot of calls this week. Uh typically throughout the course of my week, I'm responding andor communicating with folks via email. Uh every now and again, pick up the phone and we're having a conversation. But this week, I may have had 20 different telephone calls. Uh, I I have a newfound respect for the telephone call. And the reason why I say that because if it's not in person, which I prefer, the next best uh personal thing is a telephone call to hear the voice, inflection from the person, maybe even some energy, possibly uh even their mood or spirit. You can't always tell that over an email or a text. Uh and so I had over some time had lost that sensitivity to a person uh who I'm trying to build a relationship with, with the transactional approach from an email. So this week I was really able to, you know, have some conversations with folks via telephone and in person, and allow me to really get back to a core personal and professional foundation.

SPEAKER_04 2:40

Right.

SPEAKER_02 2:40

And that is personally relationships matter a lot to me. Um our relationship, relationship with my family, my friends, the folks I work for. Um, and so personally, I take that in uh into any relationship, any opportunity. If I could have the same kind of relationship focus with clients, I show up better.

SPEAKER_04 3:06

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 3:06

So that's what I was doing this week. I was just showing up better. I was listening more, I wasn't talking as much at all. I didn't have a lot of answers, right? But I continue to listen and then offer up suggestions and recommendations because at the end of the day, the person or the people I was talking with throughout the course of the week had to take the next step. It wasn't me. Right. So that's how my week was really a place of listening and humility.

SPEAKER_05 3:33

Okay. That's a great week. Uh for me, Tommy, I had a chance uh last weekend uh after the show, I met with Lloyd Ward. Uh, for those of you that may be historians, uh Lloyd Ward has the distinction of being the very first African-American CEO of a Fortune 500 company. And so uh I met with him. I remember when Lloyd Ward uh moved to Cincinnati. Uh, my dad, he was just coming out of uh Michigan State, uh having played basketball there. Uh he had joined Proctor and Gamble. My father was one of his early mentors. And so I remember him as a young man driving sports cars, man, and uh really just kind of grew up playing ball with him and watching him ascend in his career from Procter and Gamble to Pepsi, uh to PepsiCo to Fried Olay as the president of Fried Olay, and then ultimately to Maytag as the CEO of Maytag. And uh he hired me as a consultant there as well, uh, and then retired some years ago and was the uh chairman of uh one of the Olympics. And uh and now he's doing something uh sort of uh visionary. Uh it's maybe his swan song, Tommy, where he has been living in Africa for the last seven years, and he's trying to do a big investment kind of business development, industry development initiative across Africa, where they're trying to get uh several industries that are related. Uh, they're going to invest in them and then try to scale them, utilizing Western leadership uh styles and things like that to really try to make it's like a 2020 plan to make uh Africa sort of 20% of gross uh GDP in 20 years. And uh really believing that Africans need to be able to get more for what they have. Everybody comes from around the world, almost pilfering Africa. And so this is uh certainly a big, uh, audacious uh, you know, uh sort of vision, uh a blue sky opportunity, and something that I think that the world, certainly this country, is ready for at this point in time, Tommy. He's doing uh investment raises. Uh, so he has an investment class of$5,$20,$50 million. Uh, and then they're going to serve out several IPOs. So he's in Cincinnati meeting with a number of people I had a chance to meet with him for uh sort of lunch last Saturday. And then uh he went to church with me. He and his executive sister went to church with me at Christ Emanuel Christian Fellowship, and we had a blast, man. So it was just, it was just a great opportunity to also sort of go down memory lane.

SPEAKER_02 6:11

Indeed, indeed. And how long was he with you for a few days?

SPEAKER_05 6:14

Yeah, he was uh uh in Blue Ash uh there for uh a week, I believe. And we saw each other a couple of days and got a chance to sort of reminisce about uh where we've been and and uh and and where he wants to go and why. And he just believes that the insight, the leadership that uh African ancestry people have around the world can come together to do something significant.

SPEAKER_02 6:40

Yeah, that's a great story, Eric, and thanks for chiming in there. Uh it's a great opportunity for us uh to come together every every week and to unpack our previous week because we believe, or at least I do, that every week, almost every day can be different. And we never know what's gonna happen out of a conversation. Right, right. And that's why we have these diversity conversations uh every Saturday on uh at 9:30 Eastern, different times in different parts of the world. And so to our community, I like to again thank you for always joining us. Invite you to like and subscribe so we can pop up on your screen when we go live and you can revisit the conversation. If you're unable to join us live, then you just revisit the conversation and and listen in and share your thoughts here. Good deal. Tommy, you want to introduce our uh guest to our community? We have a fantastic guest for uh us this morning, the founder and CEO of Strategic Alliance Consultants, uh Yahera uh Morphino, I'm sorry, Morfonios. Uh she and I met many moons ago. She was in Louisville, Kentucky, not originally from Louisville, but she will speak to that. Uh but we met and uh we were doing assessments, culture assessments. And I really, Eric appreciated her energy, one, her insights and understanding of the organization in Louisville, Kentucky, and then most importantly, her spirit and energy. It was directly aligned to what I believe in. As I mentioned before, relationships. So when I was engaging with her, uh, we were working on business, but I saw a person as I think she saw in me and my team. So we'll bring her to the stage and have her uh kind of talk through uh her introduction, if you will. Good morning, good morning, good morning.

SPEAKER_00 8:38

Buenos días. With our good morning, Tommy and Eric. It is my honor to be here with you. I truly appreciate the invitation.

SPEAKER_02 8:51

I want to thank you for accepting the call. I reached out to you, I think it was through social media, LinkedIn, something like that. As I mentioned before, we know each other. And I this is a new introduction for you and Eric. Uh, but I wanted to say thank you for taking the time out. Uh, because I understand that you're in Louisville, you're in uh Louisiana right now, is that correct?

SPEAKER_00 9:13

Yes, I am in Louisiana right now. But as you mentioned, I am originally from the most beautiful island on earth, Puerto Rico. Yes, I'm also a proud product of the public school system. Someone who worked twice as hard to get into engineering school and even harder to graduate as a civil engineer.

SPEAKER_02 9:42

Wow, I didn't know that. That's excellent. So, what brought you to uh Kentucky, this part of the country?

SPEAKER_00 9:51

Um, to Kentucky, we have um I was moving originally to Florida, and then my husband uh was assigned to a large infrastructure project in Louisville, Kentucky. And when he brought the idea to our family, I was like, well, I gotta check that out because you know I live oceanfront in Puerto Rico. I walk to the beach that was a hard choice morning, right? And uh my family is here, so he took me to Louisville, Kentucky. It was March, end of March, and I said, No, right, I'm not coming here, I'm sorry. Right, but he was wise enough to tell me, okay, go back home and come back in June. Okay, so back in June, everything was green and beautiful, tall trees, and uh the spirit of the city was uh vibrant, and that's when he you know convinced me to stay, right? And then I suddenly forgot that the winter was coming, you know, all over again. But uh it was a beautiful journey, spending 13 years in uh Louisville, Kentucky. Uh great place to live, amazing place to raise my kids, that they're both uh one is already graduated college and the other one is finishing uh this fall.

SPEAKER_05 11:34

One of the things that we like to start with is having our guests sort of introduce them to our community. You have a number of friends that have already joined in, so you are an influencer already, but we believe that it's important for people to know not just your professional background, but who are the people and what are the experiences that you've had across your life that have made you the leader you are today?

SPEAKER_00 12:02

Wow, that's a tough question. I could be speaking here for hours and hours. Um number one, uh, and there's no script for this because I didn't see it coming. It's uh my family, you know. Uh my family is really community oriented. This like whatever is ours is from for the neighbors, for the community. We lift each other up. Okay. And uh that's not a good recipe to uh say we're never gonna be wealthy or millionaires, right? Because we're always uh lifting up the community, uh pouring ourselves into making sure that everything, everyone around us is okay. So that's my my strongest foundation was at home. My father was a community leader, my mom still today is taking care of all her neighbors. What the even that she doesn't drive, my mom, she takes the neighbors to their medical appointments, meaning that she finds someone that can do her a favor to somebody else, right? And then in my career, we had a great leaders in the technical side. I've been exposed to participate in large billion-dollar infrastructure projects where we have learned from people around the world, like the Ohio River Bridges Project in Louisville, Kentucky, that was like working for the United Nations, where we have people from France, Brazil, Puerto Rico, the locals, um Africa, Egypt, right? So all those people uh influence me on how we solve problems, interact with each other, and how do we make how do we impact lives around us? Because it's not just about delivering projects, it's about impacting the communities.

SPEAKER_05 14:28

I want to ask you another thing. When I was growing up, uh my family's very close. And I I love both of my parents. My father was a consultant, my mom was a preacher. And I'll never forget one summer when my father had accused me of smoking marijuana. And that's the only time in my life that I remember losing it and yelling at my father, because you don't you didn't yell at my father for anything. Uh and uh, and I yelled at him like, what do you mean? Don't you know me? I'm your son. And and he looked at me and he was like, Okay, okay, okay. But it was because of the values that both of my parents had placed in us. Not all of my siblings operated the same way, but I did. I believed them and I operated uh in ways that were consistent with their values. What were some of the values that you grew up with that are with you today? And how did you learn them from your parents? What were the most, maybe the three or four top values that you grew up with that you're utilizing and living out today?

SPEAKER_00 15:39

Well, family, you were really close, and also we make friends easily, right? It's like we we don't know a stranger. Everyone is our friend, and we trust in uh good people and the goodness of people, always. You know, sometimes we get disappointed, but we always give that uh trust first, right? Trusting that there's good in everyone, and don't judge people just by their looks of what they have or their car. You see me talking in the construction sites to the carpenter. I have so much respect for the carpenters and the laborers, right? Those are the ones that make things happen. Of course, I respect my uh fellow engineers, but uh I has I respect everyone, no matter where they where they're at, right? And uh that's um really important lesson from my mom. I mean, she uh feeds some kids that uh might be in the wrong path, they you know, homeless, or they're struggling at home, and she always has uh food for them, right? If they're stopping by, she knows they're hungry, right? And there's never uh looking down to a human, just to another human. So that's the first one. Family is uh we have a very flexible meaning of what family is. I moved many times from Puerto Rico to Kentucky, now from Kentucky to Louisiana, and I find family instantly in my community, my neighbors, right? And uh, and that's something that my kids used to tease me when I would I would go to baseball games and say there's a Hispanic um player, and I call and yell at them, primo, primo, right? Like it's my cousin, right? So that's how uh flexible we are, right? So and then showing up, showing up is uh another value uh that we have my family still in us, right? Just have to show up. You can't miss your shot, okay? Keep going, okay. We may have some tough times, but we just have to be resilient, just like our island in Puerto Rico, after hurricanes, after earthquakes, after corruption, right? We're still showing up every day, and I have so much uh admiration for those that are in the island showing up every day, right? To do their best. And uh the third one, it would be always do your best, excel. Okay, work harder, but excel. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 18:57

Well, I'm certain we are family, we are, and I believe that uh those values are the ones that we are desperately in need of right now in this country and around the world. And sometimes I think that we think that uh that people think that some of those foundational values are so simplistic, but those are the the best qualities of life. And I believe that uh your mother needs to run for president here, right now. We just need her to come on back and run for president because those values and being able to pick up the sick since everybody's lost their insurance anyway. Yeah, she's gonna be busy full time on that. But I love those roots that uh that you have and the way that you value and hold on to those things. Tommy?

SPEAKER_02 19:50

Yeah, I would say that uh before we start to move into the business, and I'm very, very interested in the conversation we're gonna have around the disadvantaged business enterprise, the DBE. But before we do that, uh Eric and I are both sports fans. We are former athletes, uh, still athletic in our own right, right? Right, right. Uh, and so we enjoy watching the Super Bowl and seeing our friend, our primo, right, bad bunny, a phenomenal performance from the not only the the music, but the culture. The culture. That's what I appreciated more. I appreciated that I was able to watch a Super Bowl uh performance, not in my native language of English, right? Because I believe that when you speak from your heart, you reach the heart, and it's not always the words that you can understand, it's the energy behind the words. And so, my question to you is uh, as Eric talked about and asked you about values and you shared some insights on that. Um, what are some of your interests? Do you like to sing, cook, music? These are all the things that we do, right? What are some of your personal interests?

SPEAKER_00 21:11

Oh, definitely. Uh, and my kids are gonna have a kick out of this. Um like dress up for work, you know, sharp to go to an office. But in my car, it's reggaeton playing, right? Or salsa music, and we're just you know hyping them up, make sure that they don't forget where they come from, uh, make sure that they really are proud of their culture. And it's interesting uh what you said about Bad Bunny and their performance. I have so much faith and hope in our youth, right? How the youth is stepping up into making a statement, right? Um, and just trying. Try to bring awareness of what's going on on the island. Okay. So I have so much respect for that. Of course, I enjoyed that half time show.

SPEAKER_05 22:16

Right. They almost in many ways our youth operate with less fear. They are willing to stand next to what they believe is uh their truth. And I think that we're so desperately in need of that right now because as people get older, they start counting the cost of being transparent and speaking up and and speaking uh standing on the side of right. And young people are uh believing that their whole life depends on that. And so that value system is one that we we desperately need.

SPEAKER_00 22:53

Definitely. So there's hope, right? And as you mentioned, I, you know, they're fearless, and I'm um whenever I see that, it just brings me like, oh my goodness, they have the guts to do it, and we're gonna we're gonna do it, right? We're gonna change this word as it is.

SPEAKER_02 23:17

After the show today, I actually have an opportunity to be a guest speaker here at a local university, University of Cincinnati. And there's gonna be about 100 young people, they're uh aspiring entrepreneurs. And so I am giving a 45-minute kind of talk, but interactive workshop around the CEO mindset, how to be an entrepreneur, and what are the processes to own a business. So, not just the mindset, that's one, but the certifications, the licensures, all of these things. And then from an operational perspective, I'll be talking to them some of the things that they should think about having in place. And so if you are a business and you bring in revenue, you have to pay taxes. So take care of that. You have to have some stewardship over uh money and funding. Also, if you are beyond a sole proprietorship, just one person, if you work with two or more people, how do we work with one another as colleagues, direct reports, managers, clients, etc.? One of the other things now I would be talking with them about the changing times. And so one of those changing times is what's happening with uh a what we call a disadvantaged business enterprise, a DBE. And the DBE is basically it was created to really level the playing field economically and socially. Those communities who were historically disadvantaged economically, it can be rural or Appalachia uh uh companies or companies that just weren't in the mainstream to compete against the big box organizations, and then socially, we can look at all of the various characteristics of human beings, whatever that might be, any part of our identity, uh, and how we have historically and most recently been left out of the opportunities. Can you share a little bit from your perspective of what is happening with this DBE recertification dbe process? Kind of share some light on this.

SPEAKER_00 25:47

Well, as you know, Tommy, things have changed. It's not that they're changing, they have changed, and at the beginning, there's new requirements for the DBE certification, were really confusing, not just for the companies that are disadvantaged business enterprises, but also to the prime contractors, to the Department of Transportation. Even you may feel identified with this large infrastructure projects. Large infrastructure projects have okay, a memo saying that things have changed, right? But they have a contract that says you have to meet this percentage of inclusion, right? Of disadvantaged business enterprise. So they didn't know. Still today, some of them might be confused. I mean, what do we do? Do we comply with this? Do we comply with that? What is the next step? Okay, so basically the changes are there is a requirement of a personal narrative where a disadvantaged business have to demonstrate that they have been, there has been a certain um situation that made them qualify for disadvantaged um enterprise. And uh this is quite um it's very personal, but it's also extremely painful to have to, like my colleague and friend, Dr. Lee Nikki Lanier, she said it's crazy to have to document your trauma. Yes, right, and it's also even crazier for the person that is on the other side because I we always have to look at the other side. This uh, there's are some people that will be now dedicated to read about that personal narrative with trauma, right? And their job will be to say, yes, disqualify, or no, this trauma is not good enough, right? So my perspective here, because of my background, is a little bit different. Because growing up inside the DBE framework in Puerto Rico, first, you know, all the island is all the businesses in on the island are minority-owned businesses. Yes, so yes, we have to there is certification, but everyone will qualify, right? And the same, a similar thing happens for disadvantaged business enterprise. Most of the locals were disadvantaged business enterprise. We will go for um certification just because it was a contractual advantage, but in reality, 99% of the businesses in Puerto Rico will qualify as a disadvantaged business. Okay, we have we don't have the personal net worth, okay? But now it's different. Now we have to document uh a person in um situation that's beyond just the personal net worth and the background. So when I transitioned from Puerto Rico to the to Louisville, Kentucky, that's when I was introduced to the DBE network framework, okay, and it was eye-opening to me. Because in Puerto Rico, you just have to show up, establish a relationship, and build trust, you know, partnerships. And the the certification was like a second thought, right? It was something convenient, but not a must-have, because everyone will qualify. But here I realized that the disadvantaged business is not um just a condition, it was also a system to create access to opportunities, and it was working great, right? And that's why we have changes now, because that access to opportunities is going to be narrower, yes, right. But what can we do? I mean, we have to show up, right? Yes, we just have to look at this uh personal narrative as just another requirement in the certification, and maybe Tommy, you you can tell us more about your experience with your personal narrative, and I'll and I tell mine as well.

SPEAKER_02 31:24

Yes, well, thank you for unpacking what your experience is and was in Puerto Rico and then also in in Louisville, Kentucky. So, my experience with the DBE recertification process, to your point, has been incredibly traumatizing and re-traumatizing. It has uncovered and I've had to revisit uh some of the most painful moments in my life and career that ultimately motivated me to start my business. And so in this process, I'll give you one example that I was uh uh I was a golf caddy at a private country club, and there was a uh what we call a caddy master. So go understand that is a caddy master. And then you have all these young teenage teenagers who would uh you know go through a one-week caddy school and then be accepted to be a caddy for uh this golf club. And every morning at six o'clock in the morning, a.m. Uh the caddy master would come out and he will he would direct or instruct the caddies to line up on this wall. And the and the cat and the golfers would come out and pick a caddy. And these were more seasoned, they were older cat uh golfers, members of the club. And so the golf round, which was typically 18 holes, would take about six hours. Right? Long story short, the caddies would carry the bags, they had to uh retrieve the divots. These are the pieces of earth that the golfer would kick up when swinging at the ball, and they would fly forward. And so the cat the caddies would have to run after that piece of earth, bring it back, set it back down onto the earth, clean the club, put the club in the bag, identify where the ball went, and beat the golfer to the ball. All of our golfers, because they were older, they would get golf carts. And so when they hit the ball, they would get in a golf cart and be 30 to 40 yards ahead of us. And so we would have to run for six hours in 98 degrees Fahrenheit to make$4 around. There was one rule where golf bags could not be placed on the greens, and so there was a time that I was trying to catch up with my golfer. He was on his way out of his cart to the ball that was on the green, and I was running, and there were three other caddies and golfers, and the other three caddies had put the golf cart, I mean the bag on the green, and so I ran out, placed my bag halfway on the green, and I ran to the golfer to hand him his putter. He looked at me, says, uh, thank you. He puts the ball in the hole, and then he turns to me and says, You know, I have to tell the caddy matter, caddy master that you're a bit slow. The round ends. I go to the uh the call a caddy stand, and the caddy master, who was a uh in Cincinnati, he was a Hall of Fame basketball coach at an all-boys private school. Most of the caddies attended that private school. I did not. So the caddy master came out, he called the golfer over. The golfer gave me a tip. It was a dime. He put a dime in the center of my hand, pressed it down in my hand, and made it close, and said, I would have given you a quarter if you could keep up. You people are slow. And the caddy master said, I would like you to keep your dime and never come back to this club. That moment I realized that other people had my life and livelihood in their hands. And I vowed when I got home and talked to my mother and talked to my father, I had vowed that would not happen. And my father said, When you grow up, do you want to be a caddy master, a caddy or a golfer? I said, I don't want to be any of that. I want to be an engineer. He said, then be an engineer.

SPEAKER_00 36:33

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 36:34

And so now, almost 45 years later, that's one of hundreds of instances that I'm having to unpack for the DBE recertification that I tried to put in my background, right? Because it's very painful to the point as I close, I live in the same community today that I drive past that golf course almost every weekend. And every time I drive past it with my wife in my car, my sons in the car, I remind them of the trauma that that place did for me because I was treated like an enslaved person. And I'm trying to be free to this day. Now, through this process, I have to go back, share my story with people who may not be skilled to understand my experience, or they're judging my experience as not good enough. It is the DBE recertification process. Thank you for allowing me to share that because that is one of many things that are very painful in this process.

SPEAKER_00 37:47

Wow. Thank you for opening up like that. It's uh it's one of the things that we uh we have to, as a disadvantaged business enterprise, go through. So it's not about your personal net worth, it's now about your value as a person, right? And as you mentioned, somebody will judge you, someone will judge you. So the compliance requirement uh for that personal narrative is brutal, is uh not just difficult to go back to that trauma, but it's painful. You've been asked to document deeply personal experiences, sometimes even trauma, and present them for review. So that can wear you down, it's really uncomfortable. And what's happening is a lot of DBEs are just giving up. You're strong enough to face those demons from your past, right? Or just go relieve that painful experience, but there are going to be others that just can't face it again, right? They don't want to go back.

SPEAKER_05 39:17

Right. I just want to weigh in for a second because I believe Tommy, thank you for sharing that story, man. That's just powerful. And I would say that there's some words that we haven't used in a while, and you don't hear them across the media very often. One of them is racist, the other is sexist, uh, the third is classist. Those are words that are not words of the past, they are words of the present. And I believe that the actions of people today are going to bring those words back. Uh, I believe that it is the classist element of what's happening right now that's going to maybe create uh unity among affected people. Uh, because just like Tommy said, you're talking to people that may not care. I mean, that's where we are right now. You write up your story and your most painful story, and and and and there's some people politically right now that do not care, they're laughing at you having to go through the exercise. Yeah, and so I think in part we just have to be patient enough to wade wait wait this out. But in the midst of that, not everybody's making it.

SPEAKER_02 40:36

Yeah, I would add as well, very quickly, that even with the DBE recertification, you cannot mention anything related to race, right? Right, you cannot mention anything related to gender, right? And it's twofold it's economic disadvantage and social. So the social disadvantage is race, gender, uh, ability, etc. The economic is economics, it's it's that's what it is. So literally, you cannot mention that you've been discriminated based on those identities of your life, right? But at the same time, uh they're saying that if you go as far back to where you were born in the place that you were born, if it was, for example, impoverished, then you can share that that's where you was born and raised, but also show documentation that you were economically disadvantaged because you grew up in an economically disadvantaged area. And so some folks are saying, I'm 65 years old. Right do I do not have that documentation that does it's bananas, and to your point, folks are just wearing out, uh let alone and and please pardon me here because I feel and experience the pain. I know of real stories where women-owned businesses have had to revisit and justify and document where they were sexually assaulted at work or et cetera, and they've had to go back and you have they've been they've had to get medical records to say, were you really sexually assaulted? And they say, Yes, I was, I lived it. And the subjective, uncredential reviewer is saying, I don't believe it.

SPEAKER_00 42:40

So any additional thoughts, prove it, prove it, prove it, yeah, yeah, that's horrible, and I have to add, um, is those that are in charge of reviewing and evaluating, scoring your trauma or validating your trauma, they have no proper training or guidelines. It's similar to another agency, uh ICE, where they have uh to recruit a lot of people and just give them a gun, a batch, and go to the streets, right? The this program still lacks of proper guidelines, so everyone is learning on the way, and that's where you feel like um they will say it's not good enough, you have to prove this and this and that. And um another thing that you mentioned, they don't care about your pain. Actually, they should they will just ignore it, right? They look for why, how, when, proof.

SPEAKER_02 43:55

Right. They just ignore it, right, right. And in in literally The how when where why it's very scripted, right? Whereby uh meaning that that is the go-to response to asking the question, help me understand how I can I better frame my personal narrative. Is it just say that where, when, where, how, how. And then also we all we we know that there's certain states in the United States that have fewer uh DBE certified companies and SBE, MBE, WBE, etc., than others. So there are a few states in this country right now who are complete with their DBE recertification reviews. Ohio is not one, right? Texas is not another, Florida, California, these have hundreds, if not thousands of DBE certified organizations. Why? Because 10 years ago, 15 years ago, 20 years ago, they had to get certified to be to have any competitive opportunity to bid for crumbs of projects. And this is all being dismantled. This too shall pass. It's not woe is me. Right. The world is coming to an end. But can you can you share a little bit more about you know, maybe how your organization, strategic alliance consultants, may either help DBE companies or help the clients that you work with?

SPEAKER_00 45:41

Oh, that's a great question. Actually, you know, our job as a program manager, my job is not just to uh help our clients deliver complex projects, but also is to create space for the small and disadvantaged business to grow and compete, not just for crumbs, okay, to be a real partner. And that's where we excel, right? We uh help our clients, okay. We have all these opportunities. We have you have to be um aware of your responsibility, of the power that you have for economic development, for impacting the community, and that's where we bring a lot of value, okay? There's space for all of us. Let's just make sure that we create the space where everyone can excel, build partnerships, right? And that's my message to the disadvantaged business enterprises that we that are on the verge of whether they want to proceed with the certification or not. We have to reframe it. This is a requirement, like any other requirement in your business. Have you paid taxes? Do this, that, show me the proof. We have to comply. We comply, we document, and we move forward. That's the message. The certification is not the goal, it's a stepping stone. Okay, and just like Alexander Hamilton said, I'm not throwing away my shot, right? You have to do it. Let's do it, okay? There's a lot of consultants that can help you uh reframe that um narrative. We are one of them. I mean, we will help you. I know it's painful, but we have a lot of faults, uh, especially Dr. Nikki Lanier. I admire her so much. She's uh collaborated with us in certain projects where she has uh her, you know, she's an attorney, right? And also a great human being that will help us, right? Draft that uh narrative that is so painful to everyone. But you still have to comply with everyone, everything else. You have to comply with the personal uh net worth, you have to comply with everything else. So we have to see this not just as a roadblock or as a thing to go through is a requirement.

SPEAKER_05 48:33

Let me ask you. Yeah, I have a question for I have a question for you. Um, are you seeing today? And I want you to pause and think about this because as uh the NMSDC had us as minority certified, uh, and over the 27 years that I was a certified minority uh contractor, I can count on one hand the amount of business that I ever got that was a result of that. And so my question to you is in these days and times that we're living in, is certification um honestly delivering opportunities for the average uh businesses, or are you finding that the need of contractors is so great that they have to get folks wherever they can get them from?

SPEAKER_00 49:28

Wow, that's a great question. Look, um I mentioned when I come from Puerto Rico, the certification was not needed, right? It's uh contracts are you just have to bring value, right? Because anyone could get the certification. And so having the certification, it would not open doors because we were all minorities, we're all disadvantaged, right? So I think that's uh that background makes me realize that the certification is not gonna guarantee you anything in this environment, right? You have to, this is just a stepping stone, okay. You wanna be in the room where it happens by being visible, build trust, and build partnerships. I think uh for many years people were just saying that well, we need we it's mandatory, right? We have to hire them, crumbs, as Tommy mentioned. Now, because you know, we need to as a business, right? Whether you're disadvantaged business or not, just be visible, build trust, build partnerships, but also perform. If you don't deliver, you know, the certification is not gonna save you. So it's a lot of it's a responsibility as well. The certification is just, you know, uh, doesn't mean that you're visible, doesn't mean that you're gonna get any uh contracts, the real job comes after the certification. How do I get seen?

SPEAKER_05 51:24

Right. One of the things that I loved about WeBank. So I I had a chance to speak at uh WeBank Women's Business Enterprise uh network, and and what I saw there that was different was that when you got in the room at the NMSDC, it felt like all the minority businesses, many of them were pressing their nose against the glass, waiting for the proctoring gambles and Toyotas to show up. Like, when are they gonna get here? And I hope they send a real decision maker. At the We Bank event, I would see women, I came there as a speaker, and they were networking me with other women-owned businesses. In other words, they weren't just waiting on big corporations to come in the room, they were networking with each other. How important do you believe it is for uh disadvantaged businesses to look at what we can do to support each other and not just simply be waiting on contracts from you know major corporations or contracting agencies?

SPEAKER_00 52:24

Definitely. The power of partnerships, right? It's difficult. It's not uh it's not it's like a marriage, right? When you're you and you have a partner, it's uh it's like a marriage. You have to, there will be times where we don't agree, and there will be times that we do agree, there will be times where we grow in different directions, but at the end of the day, if we move forward together, we grow. So that's really uh extremely important for um us to partner, you know. Two small guys can become a medium or large size prime contractor, and that's uh really powerful. It is also hard to do, but it's not impossible. So it's a matter of what are your goals? I mean, if you want to play, you know, stay small, not everybody wants to have a large business because that's more difficult to manage, right? But if your goal is to grow, partnership is the key to success.

SPEAKER_05 53:35

And Tommy, I want to ask you to weigh in on this too, because this is a bunch of what you do. What are you seeing as best practices in the turbulent waters that we're living in today?

SPEAKER_02 53:46

So on your major construction projects uh across the US, oftentimes uh the prime contractors are joining together. They're creating partnerships, joint ventures. Uh those are very large companies that uh they start with uh uh the legal uh legal side, the legalese, so contracts to make sure that any of the operations from finance to production to assets, that those are legally protected underneath uh the partnership. In other words, each if it's two companies, uh this contract, this partnership, this uh LLC that we're creating, we are we'll still keep what's ours, and you'll still still keep with what is yours. But because we have some resources to pull together a uh uh a legal team to make sure that this uh 100-page document is accurate, we can do that. For smaller organizations, it's not happening as much. There's a number of reasons, but here's three reasons one is money. I don't have the money, the revenue to partner. I'm trying to stay afloat all by myself, right? Let alone trying to work with another organization, et cetera, et cetera. Uh two, from my perspective, there's a lot of emotion that a company owner, a founder has about their company. And at this time, I'm not gonna partner with anyone because I spent the last 20 or 30 years trying to build up to this little small company, right? And so you I'm not gonna give up my baby, right? I will go down with the ship. So that sentimental connection that the business owner has, that's that's a challenge. And then the the third, I think, is just the business. I really honestly believe that there are some very, very smart and good companies out here. Smaller companies, you know, that are employing less than a hundred employees or 50 or 10. Very good. But oftentimes the founder or the business owner, the entrepreneur, they have done the work in one way, shape, or form. And so because they have done the work and may continue to do the work, that the business side is not their strength.

SPEAKER_04 56:26

Right, right?

SPEAKER_02 56:27

Again, paying taxes, right? Bookkeeping is not their strength, right? Paying folks on certified payroll is not their strength. Dealing with folks out in the yard who can't get along, the business owner says, just get the job done. Right, right, right, so we can invoice the client and get paid, so you can get paid. Just instead of hold on, everyone, kumbaya, the owner is not interested in that at all. However, again, the larger companies have the bandwidth and the resources to then hire the HR person to deal with the people systems.

SPEAKER_00 57:07

And how much does that cost?

SPEAKER_02 57:09

And how much does that cost into the tens of thousands? It's the addition, all of that. You're right.

SPEAKER_00 57:17

And the lead, and we when you mention about, you know, and I was telling you cut money, money is not just about capital. How much do you think it costs to the legal team to put together that partnership? And then you have to pay them through project completion because they will be your uh right, your legal team. It has to go every I mean all the way because there will be um discrepancies or you know, different uh opinions throughout the the project life, and you're paying them all the time. So um partnerships are great, but there has to be a simpler way, right? Because um otherwise it's it's a door that is just closed for us. Because even if you don't get paid, you have to pay the consultants, you have to pay the legal team, you have to pay the HR team, you have to pay the accountant, it's a controller, and it's a lot, it's a lot before you even see uh one dollar. So it is a good idea, but it needs a level of uh maturity. You have to be mature in your business, already have those systems in place before you move on with a partnership.

SPEAKER_05 58:44

Let me ask you this as we prepare to close out, and then I'm gonna let Tommy have both the final word with you and then to close us out. Uh, we appreciate you joining us today. And we know that our community is vast, and there are a number of people that may be saying, Wow, this space is so confusing today. How might they reach out to you if they just want to get some understanding, better understanding, or ask questions about your perspective? How might people be able to uh to reach out and connect with you?

SPEAKER_00 59:18

Oh, with me? Oh, yeah. I, you know, they can they can find me on LinkedIn. We have also uh social media with um our own uh webpage, strategicalliance consultants.com. Linkin is uh really my go-to when it turns to professional um network. Okay, but I also um I'm really easy to find because I assure you no one else in the world has my name. My combination of first name and last name uh is unique, right? Because it has a Puerto Rican heritage and Greek, so not many of uh, I mean, there will be no one else with my name. Okay, but uh thank you for the opportunity to uh showcase that they they can reach us. We're happy to help. And at the end of the day, this journey is not easy, but it was never meant to be easy. We just have to be resilient, excellent. We have to find a way, we've always found a way to build, to grow, and create an opportunity. It might hurt today, but we'll find it, we'll find our way. So even in the most challenging environments, and believe me, 2025 has been tough for me, has been tough for my uh my team, tough for me, but we're not giving up. Okay, the system is evolving, the expectations are higher, but so are we. Excellent, excellent, as well as we believe that the future belongs to those who choose to rise, adapt, and lead with value.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:11

Yes, excellent. We could not say anything more than this. That was a great ending motivation to continue to encourage each individual, each small, medium, large company, each person who's thinking about starting a business, yeah. Do not be demotivated, do not be discouraged. We need to just continue to do it because uh in this country and across the world, it's still folks like us who create the economic cycle, kind of the ecosystem to build uh any form of way of life, play, work, etc., for our immediate community and families is what we do. And so with that being said, I would like to thank our community as always every Saturday morning, 9 30 Eastern, for joining us this Saturday for another Diversity Conversations. Take care.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:12

Bye now.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:13

Thank you so much.